Critical Apparatus for this Page
Commentary on the Text
Names and Places on this Page
Unavailable for this Edition
1635 [1581]

Queene Mary. Disputation of Doct. Cranmer Archbishop of Canterbury in Oxforde.

Marginalia1554. Aprill.specturi quis ea negligat, quis non obseruet, & inde venturi vt de omnibus iudicet? That is to say.

MarginaliaAugust. De Vnitate Ecclesiæ.What a thing is this I pray you? when the last words of one lying on his death bed are heard, which is ready to go to his graue, no man saith þt he hath made a lie: and he is not accompted his heire, which regardeth not those wordes. How shal we then escape Gods wrath if either not beleuing or not regarding, we shall reiect the last wordes both of the onely sonne of God and also of our Lord and Sauiour, both ascending into heauen, and beholding from thence who despiseth and who obserueth them not, and shall come from thence to iudge all men?

[Back to Top]

The argument is thus formed.

MarginaliaArgument.Bar
Who so euer saith, that the Testator did lie, is a wic-
ked heyre.
ba
But whosoeuer sayth that Christ spake by figures,
sayth that he did lie:
ra.
Ergo, whosoeuer sayth that Christ here spake by fi-
gures is a wycked heyre.

MarginaliaAunswere.Cran. I deny the Minor. As who say it is necessary that hee which vseth to speake by tropes and figures, should lye in so doing.

Ogle. Your iudgement is disagreing wt al churches.

Cran. Nay, I disagree with the papisticall church.

Ogle. This you do through þe ignorance of logicke.

Cran. Nay, this you say through the ignorance of the Doctours.

 

Commentary  *  Close

Foxe deleted a passage that described Weston's behaving courteously to Cranmer (See textual variant 50).

Weston. I wyll go playnly to worke by Scriptures. What tooke hee?

Cranmer. Bread.

Weston. What gaue hee?

Cranmer. Bread.

Weston. What brake hee?

Cranmer. Bread.

Weston. What did they eate?

Cranmer. Bread.

MarginaliaArgument.West. He gaue bread, therefore he gaue not his body.

He gaue not his body, therefore it is not his body verily, in deede, and in truth.

Cran. I deny the argument.

Cole. Thys argument holdeth MarginaliaDisparata, is a schole terme, meaning diuers substances being so sondred in nature, that one can neuer be sayd to be the other.a disparatis. It is bread: Ergo it is not the body: and it is such an argument or reason, as cannot be dissolued.

Cran. The lyke argument may bee made: Hee is a rocke: Ergo he is not Christ.

Cole. It is not lyke.

Weston. He gaue not his body in deede: Ergo it was not hys body in deede.

Cranmer. He gaue hys death, his passion, and the sacrament of his passion. MarginaliaThe sacramēt setting the figure aside, formally is not Christes body.And in very deede setting the figure aside, formally it is not hys body.

Weston. Why? then the scripture is false.

Cran. Nay, the scripture is most true.

West. This sayth Chrysostome Homel. 61. ad populum Antiochenum, Necessarium est dilectissimi, mysteriorum dicere miraculum quid tandem sit, & quare sit datum, & quæ rei vtilitas. &c. That is to say.

MarginaliaChrysost. Hom. 61.Needefull it is (deare frendes) to tell you what the miracle of the mysteries is, and wherefore it is geuen, and what profite there is of the thing. We are one body & mēbers of his flesh, & of his bones. We that be in the mysterie, let vs folow that thing which was spoken. Wherfore, that we may become this thing, not onely by loue, but also þt we may become one wyth that flesh in deede, that is brought to passe by this foode which hee gaue vnto vs, minding to shew his great good will that he hath toward vs: And therfore he mixed him self wyth vs, and vnited his own body with vs, that we should be made all as one thing together, as a body ioyned and annexed to the head, for thys is a token of most ardent and perfect loue. And the same thyng Iob also insinuating, sayd of hys seruauntes, of whom he was desyred aboue measure, in so much that they, shewing their great desyre toward him, sayd: who shall geue vnto vs to be fylled with his flesh? Therefore also Christ did the same, who, to iuduce vs into a greater loue toward him, and to declare his desyre toward vs, did not onely geue himself to be seene of them that would, but also to be handled

[Back to Top]

and eaten, and suffred vs to fasten our teeth in his flesh, and to be vnited together, and so to fyll all our desyre. Like Lions therefore, as breathing fire, let vs go from that table, being made terrible to the deuil, remembryng our head in our minde, & his charitie which hee shewed vnto vs. For Parents many times geue their chyldren to other to be fed, but I doo not so (sayth he) but feede you with mine own flesh, and set my selfe before you, desyring to make you all ioly people, and pretēding to you great hope and expectation to looke for things to come, who here geue my selfe to you: but much more in the world to come. I am become your brother, I tooke flesh and bloude for you. Agayne my flesh and bloud by the whych I am made your kinsman, I deliuer vnto you.

[Back to Top]

Thus much out of Chrysostome. Out of whych wordes I make this argument.

MarginaliaD. Westons argumēt without true forme or figure.The same flesh whereby Christ is made our brother and kinsman, is geuen of Christ to vs to be eaten.

Christ is made our brother and kinsman by his true, naturall, and organicall flesh:

Ergo, his true, naturall, and organicall flesh is geuen to vs to be eaten.

Cran. I graunt the consequence and the consequent.

Weston. Therefore we eate it with our mouth.

MarginaliaD. Westons argument denyed: we eate the true body of Christ: Ergo, we eate it with our mouth.Cran. I deny it. We eate it through fayth.

West. He gaue vs that same flesh to eate, whereby he became our brother and kinsman.

But he became our brother & kinsman by hys true, naturalll, and organicall flesh:

MarginaliaA figureles Argument.Therefore he gaue hys true, naturall, and organical flesh to bee eaten.

Cran. I graunt, he tooke and gaue the same true, naturall, and organicall flesh wherein hee suffered: and yet hee feedeth spiritually, and that flesh is receaued spiritually.

MarginaliaFallax a dicto secundū quid ad simpliciter.Weston. He gaue vs the same flesh whych he tooke of the Virgin:

But he tooke not hys true flesh of the Virgine spiritually, or in a figure:

Ergo he gaue his true natural flesh not spiritually.

MarginaliaAunswere.Cran.Christ gaue to vs his owne naturall flesh, the same wherein he suffered, but feedeth vs spiritually.

Weston. Chrisostome is agaynst you, Homel. 83. in. 26. Cap. Math. where he sayth: MarginaliaChrysostome alleaged by D. Weston, Hom 83. in 26. cap. Mat.Veniat tibi in mentem quo sis honore honoratus, qua mensa fruaris. Ea nam re nos alimur, quam angeli. &c. That is.

Let it come into thy remembraunce with what honor thou art honoured, & what table thou sittest at: for with the same thing we are nourished, which the Aungels do behold and tremble at: neither are they able to beholde without great feare for the brightnes which commeth thereof: and we be brought and compact into one heape or masse wyth him, being together one body of Christ, and one flesh with him. Who shall speake the powers of the Lord, and shall declare forth all his prayses? What Pastor hath euer nourished his shepe with his own mēbers? Many mothers haue put forth their Infantes after their byrth, to other Nurses: which he would not do, but feedeth vs with hys own body, and conioyneth and vniteth vs to him selfe.

[Back to Top]

Whereupon I gather this argument.

MarginaliaAn other false argument where in the 3. figure the Minor is a negatiue.Like as mothers nurse theyr children with milke: so Christ nourisheth vs with hys body.

But mothers do not nourish their infantes spiritually with their milke:

Therfore Christ doth not nourish those that be hys, spiritually with hys bloud.

MarginaliaAunswere.Cran. He gaue vs the wyne for hys bloud.

MarginaliaArgument.West. If he gaue the wine for his bloud (as you say) then he gaue lesse then mothers do geue.

But Chrysostome affyrmeth that he gaue more thē mothers geue:

Therfore he gaue not the wyne for hys bloud.

MarginaliaChrist nourisheth vs both with bread and with his body: with bread our bodyes, with hys body our soules.Cran. You peruert myne aūswere. He gaue wyne, yet the bloud is considered therin. As for example: whē he geueth Baptisme, we consider not the water, but the holy Ghost, and remission of sinnes. We receaue with the mouth the Sacrament: but the thyng and the

[Back to Top]
matter
IIIi.iiij.
Go To Modern Page No:  
Click on this link to switch between the Modern pagination for this edition and Foxe's original pagination when searching for a page number. Note that the pagination displayed in the transcription is the modern pagination with Foxe's original pagination in square brackets.
Find:
Type a keyword and then restrict it to a particular edition using the dropdown menu. You can search for single words or phrases. When searching for single words, the search engine automatically imposes a wildcard at the end of the keyword in order to retrieve both whole and part words. For example, a search for "queen" will retrieve "queen", "queene" and "queenes" etc.
in:  
Humanities Research Institute  *  HRI Online  *  Feedback
Version 2.0 © 2011 The University of Sheffield