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1121 [1120]

K. Hen. 8. The disputation of Lambert before the king.

thou persecute me? I am Iesus whom thou persecutest. et cet. MarginaliaAct. 9. Here this place doth nothyng let but þt Christ sittyng in heauen, might speake vnto Paule, and be heard vpon earth, for they whiche were with Paule verely heard the voyce, but did see no body.

MarginaliaThe Archbishops replie. The Archbyshop on the contrary part, sayd: Paule him selfe doth witnesse. Actes. xxvi. that Christ dyd appeare vnto him in the same vision.

MarginaliaAunswere to the replye. But Lambert agayne sayd, that Christ dyd witnesse in the same place, That he would agayne appeare vnto hym, and deliuer hym out of the handes of the Gentiles: Notwithstandyng we read in no place, that Christ did corporally appeare vnto him,

Thus, when they had contended about the conuersion of S. Paule, and Lambert so aunswearyng for hymselfe, that the kyng semed greatly to be moued therwith, and the Byshop hymselfe that disputed, to be entangled, and all the audience amased: MarginaliaThe hastie impudencye of the byshop of Winchester. then the Byshop of Winchester, whiche was appointed þe vj. place of the disputation, fearyng lest þe argument should be taken out of his mouth, or rather beyng drowned with malice agaynst the poore man, without the kynges commaundement, obseruyng no order, before the Archbyshop had made an ende, vnshamefastly kneeled downe to take in hand the disputation, MarginaliaThe reason of Stephen Wint. alledged a place out of the xij. Chapter to the Corinthians, where S. Paule sayth: Haue not I sene Iesus? And agayne in the. xv. Chapter: He appeared vnto Cephas, and afterward vnto Iames, then to all the Apostles, but last of all, he appeared vnto me as one borne out of due tyme. &c. Marginalia1. Cor. 15.

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Hereunto, Lambert aunswered, he dyd nothyng doubt but that Christ was sene, and dyd appeare, but he dyd deny that he was in two or in diuers places, accordyng to þe manner of his body.

MarginaliaWint. replyeth. Then Winchester agayne, abusing the authoritie of Paule, repeateth the place out of the second Epistle to the Corinthians and. v. Chapter: And if so be, we haue knowen Christ after the fleshe, now henceforth know we hym so no more. &c. Marginalia2. Cor. 5.

MarginaliaLambert aunswereth to Wint. Lambert, aunswered, that this knowledge is not to be vnderstanded accordyng to the sense of the body, and that it so appeared sufficiently by S. Paule, whiche speakyng of his owne reuelation, sayth thus: I knowe not whether in the body or without the body, God knoweth, which was rapt into the third heauē, I know not, whether in the body or without, God knoweth. Whereby, euen by the testimony of S. Paule, a mā shall easely gather, þt in this reuelation he was taken vp in sprite into the heauens, and did see those things, rather then that Christ came downe corporally from heauen, to shew thē vnto him: especially, for that it was sayd of the Aungell: That euen as he ascended into heauen, so he should come agayne. And S. Peter sayth, whom it behoueth to dwell in the heauens. And moreouer appointing the measure of tyme, he addeth: Euen vntill that all thynges be restored. &c. Here agayne, Lambert beyng taunted and rebuked could not be suffered to prosecute his purpose.

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MarginaliaTonstall Byshop of Durisme agaynst Lambert. After the Byshop of Winchester had done, Tonstall Bishop of Durham tooke his course, and after a long Preface, wherein he spake much of Gods omnipotencie, at the last he came to this poynt, saying: that if Christ could performe that which he spake touchyng the conuertyng of his body into bread, without doubt he would speake nothyng, but that he would performe.

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MarginaliaThe aūswere of Lambert to Tunstall. Lambert aunswered, that there was no euident place of Scripture, wherein Christ doth at any tyme say, that he would chaunge the bread into his body: and moreouer, that there is no necessitie why he should so do. MarginaliaThe figuratiue phrase of the scripture to be marked. But this is a figuratiue speach, euery where vsed in the Scripture, when as the name and appellation of the thyng signified, is attributed vnto the signe. By which figure of speach, Circumcision is called the couenaūt, the Lambe, the passeouer: beside vj. hundreth such other.

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Now it remayneth to be marked, whether we shall iudge all these after the wordes pronounced, to be straight way chaunged into an other nature. Then agayne began they to rage a fresh agaynst Lambert, so that if he could not be ouercome with argumentes, he should be vanquished with rebukes and tauntes. What should he do? He might well hold his peace like a Lambe, but byte or barke agayne he could not.

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MarginaliaThe wicked boast of Stokesley. Next orderly stepped forth the valiant champion Stokesley Byshop of London, who afterward lying at the poynt of death, reioysed, boastyng, that in his life tyme he had burned 50. heretickes. This man amongest the residue, intendyng to fight for his belly, with a long Protestation promised to proue, that it was not onely a worke of a diuine miracle, but also that it dyd nothyng abhorre nature. For, it is nothyng dissonant from nature (sayth he) the substaūces of like thynges to be oftentymes chaunged one into an other: So that neuertheles, the accidentes do remaine all be it the substance it selfe, and the matter subiect be chaunged. MarginaliaThe waterish cold argumēnt of Stokesley. Thē he declared it by the example of water boylyng so long vpon the fire, vntill all the substaunce therof be euaporate. Now sayth he) it is the doctrine of the Philosophers, that a substaunce can not be chaunged, but into a substaūce: MarginaliaOne substance may be chaunged into an other but then the accidents chaunge also with it. wherfore we do affirme the substaunce of the water, to passe into the substance of the ayre. Notwithstanding the qualitie of the water, which is moystnesse, remaineth after the substaunce is chaunged, for the ayre is moyst, euen as the water is.

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MarginaliaThe bishops triumph before the vyctorye. When this argument was heard, the Byshops greatly reioysed, and sodenly their coūtenaunce chaunged as it were assuryng themselues of a certaine triumphe and victory by this Philosophicall transmutation of elementes, & lyke as it had bene of more force, then Crisippus argument, which passed all maner of solution.

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MarginaliaLambertes aunswer to Stokesley Lambertes aunswere was long looked for here of all men. Who, as soone as he had obtained silence and libertie to speake, first of all denyed the Byshoppes assumpte that the moysture of the water dyd remaine after the substance was altered. For albeit (sayth he) that we do graunt with the Philosophers the ayre to be naturally moyst, notwithstandyng it hath one proper and a diuers degree of moysture, and the water an other. Wherefore, when as the water is conuerted into the ayre, there remaineth moysture, as you do say, but that is not the moysture of water, but the proper and naturall moysture of the ayre. Whereupon there is an other doctrine amongest the Philosophers, as a perpetuall rule, that it can by no meanes be, that the qualities and accidentes in naturall thynges should remaine in their owne proper nature, without their proper subiect. MarginaliaTauntes & raging agaynst Lambert.

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Then agayne the kyng and the Byshops raged agaynst Lambert, in somuch that he was not onely forced to silence, but also might haue bene driuen into a rage, if his eares had not bene acquaynted with such tauntes afore. After this the other Byshops, euery one in his order, as they were appointed, supplyed their places of disputation.

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MarginaliaTen disputers agaynst Lambert. There were appoynted ten in number, for the performyng of this Tragedy, for his ten Argumentes, which, (as before we haue declared) were deliued vnto Taylor the preacher. It were to long in this place, to repeate the reasons and argumentes of euery Byshop: and no lesse superfluous were it so to do, specially for somuch as they were all but cōmon reasons, & nothyng forceable, and such as by the long vse of disputation haue bene beaten, & had litle in them, either worthy the hearer, or the reader.

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MarginaliaLambert in great perplexitie. Lambert in the meane tyme beyng compassed in with so many and great perplexities, vexed on the one side with checkes and tauntes, and pressed on the other side, with the authoritie and threates of the personages, and partly beyng amazed with the maiestie of the place in the presence of the kyng, and especially beyng weryed with long standyng, whiche continued no lesse then fiue houres, from twelue of the clocke, vntill fiue at night, MarginaliaLambert keepeth silence when speaking would do no good. beyng brought in despayre that he should nothyng profite in this purpose, and seyng no hope at all in speakyng, was at this poynt, that he chose rather to holde his peace.

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Whereby it came to passe, that those Byshops, whiche last of all disputed with him, spake what they lusted without interruption, saue onely that Lambert now and then, would alledge somewhat out of S. Augustine for the defēce of his cause, in which author he semed to be very prōpt and ready. But for the most part (as I sayd) beyng ouercome with werynes and other griefes, he held his peace, defendyng himselfe rather with silence, then with argumēts, which he saw would nothyng at all preuaile.

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At the last, when the day was passed, and that torches began to be lighted, the kyng mindyng to breake vp this pretensed disputation, sayd vnto Lambert in this wise: MarginaliaThe kinges wordes to Lambert. What sayst thou now (sayd he) after all these great labours which thou hast taken vpon thee, and all the reasons & instructiōs of these learned men, art thou not yet satisfied? Wilt thou liue, or dye? What sayest thou? Thou hast yet free choyse. Lambert aunswered: I yeld and submit my selfe wholy vnto the will of your Maiestie. Then sayd the kyng. Commit thy selfe vnto the handes of God, and not vnto myne.

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Lambert. I commende my soule vnto the handes of God, but my body I wholy yeld and submit vnto your clemencie. MarginaliaThe king condemneth the Martyr of Christ, Iohn Lambert. Then sayd the kyng, if you do commit your selfe vnto my iudgement, you must dye, for I will not be a patron vnto heretickes, and by and by, turnyng him selfe vnto Crōwell, he sayd: MarginaliaL. Cromwell commaunded by the king to reade the sentence. Crōwell, read þe sentence of cōdēnation agaynst him. This Cromwell was at that tyme the chief frend of the Gospellers. And here is it much to be maruayled at, to see how vnfortunatly it came to passe in this matter, that thorough the pestiferous & craftie counsaile of thys one Byshop of Winchester, Sathā (which oftentymes doth raise vp one brother to the destruction of an other) dyd here

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